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Vineeto’s Correspondence on the Actual
Freedom List
Correspondent No 83
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Topics covered
Going by my
own experience I would not rule out the possibility of some sort of an ASC experience, in a ‘self’-less experiencing
of the universe either in a temporary PCE or a permanent Actual Freedom there is no such thing as meta-physics * as the ‘physical ‘turning over’ of some kind’ happened to Richard when he became
enlightened there are obviously other criteria to consider if one wants to genuinely determine if one has become
actually free or not.
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 Continued from General Correspondence No 9
15.4.2005
You wrote at the end of your post –
P.S. You are free to post this on the website if you
wish, I have as yet not decided if I would like to be in the discussion group or not. Again I appreciate when/if you
have the time to respond to this email.
Given that you gave the permission I will post my answer to the AF mailing
list. Welcome.
Thanks for the email. To be honest I was pondering
whether or not to join the discussion list. I haven’t decided as yet. Several things have occurred to me since writing
you the first email. The main thing I noticed was that I played down the occurrence of the event that happened at the
back of my brain – if was at the top of the neck, bottom of the brain – it was exactly what Richard described as a
‘turning over’ of something in the brain stem. I have had this experience and much has changed since. Like I
mentioned the ‘deprogramming’ – all this is occurring at a fast rate and my actions are totally factually based as
before.
I know that No 81 is having conversations with the group online to question
the language being used by yourself ‘matter and energy’. He came to me at breakfast to talk about his ideas about
this and to explain it to me. To be honest if the turning over in the back of the brain is the process to AF, then I
think I am in AF and am actually now removing all the ‘old behaviour’ that I had.
It is pertinent to note that Richard described having this experience of
‘something turning over’ when he became enlightened, not when he became actually free –
Richard: About six weeks prior to the sixth of
September 1981 I had a revelation that I was going to really die this time, not become catatonic again, and that I was
to prepare myself for it. I mustered all of my faith and resolution, renewed all of my trust and dedication, and awaited
the day. The night before I could hardly maintain myself as a thinking, functioning human being as a blistering hot and
cold burning sensation crept up the back of my spine and entered into the base of my neck just under the brain itself. I
went to bed in desperation and frustration at my apparent inability to be good enough to carry this ‘process’
through to its supreme conclusion.
The next morning I awoke and all was calm and quiet. Expressing relief at the
cessation of the intensifying ‘process’ that had reached an unbearable level the night before, I lay back on my
pillows to watch the rising sun (my bedroom faced east) through the large bedroom windows. All of a sudden I was gripped
with the realisation that this was the moment! I was going to die! An intense fear raced throughout my body, rising in
crescendo until I could scarcely take any more. As it reached a peak of stark terror, I realised that I had nothing to
worry about and that I was to go with the ‘process’. In an instant all fear left me and I travelled deep into the
depths of my very being. All of a sudden I was sitting bolt upright, laughing, as I realised that this that was IT! was
such a simple thing ... all I had to do was die ... and that was the easiest thing in the world to do. Then the thought
of leaving my family and friends overwhelmed me and I was thrust back on the bed sobbing. Then I was bolt upright once
more laughing my head off ... then I was back on the pillows sobbing my heart out ... upright, laughing ... pillows
sobbing ... upright laughing ... pillows sobbing. At the fifth or sixth time something turned over in the base of my
brain – in the top of the brain-stem. I likened it to turning over a L.P. record in order to play the other side ...
with the vital exception that it would never, ever turn back again. Richard, Articles, A Brief Personal History
I think my experience is a little different to yourself
and Richard and Peter because you all had a longer period to ‘deprogram’ over years. I think in my case it has
happened much quicker – in a period of a couple of weeks because I was brought up to be happy and harmless and my
experiences of the world is really done through the eyes of a child and with naiveté and so in a way I was given less
to decondition – I just turned 30. I have written this in my diary this morning and was wondering if you could show it
to Richard to see if his interpretation of AF is the same:
‘I explained to No 81there are 3 things that I can be compared with a
computer in terms of my functioning When I am asleep, my senses are on HIBERNATE and take a longer time to come online
When I am awake and not thinking then my senses are on STANDBY When I am functioning and doing a task because of
discomfort of the body, or out of necessity, then my senses are ON and my hypothesis is when my senses are off –
either they are not functioning (e.g. to be blind) or I am dead. The only thing is that to get from STANDBY to ON is
only necessary when I need something.’
I have forwarded your post to Richard as requested.
So this is what I have been thinking over the course
of the morning: What I found is that when I am on STANDBY, I feel that I am not different from anything in the whole
Universe – not in terms of material, but in terms of something that is not describable. When I go from STANDBY to ON,
there needs to be a question that is asked, such as if I am slouching in STANDBY mode, then my back may ache and I will
automatically correct my posture, but the asking of the question ‘How can I reduce my slouching posture?’ is the
first part of the process of switching myself ON – it is task orientated.
After speaking with No 81 this morning, I would say that the problem of all
religions doesn’t come from this idea of being in this state/ place of STANDBY and relishing this moment of wonder,
but rather it comes when I get switched on by asking ‘What am I?’ If you can ask Richard to test the following out
like I have this morning, then we may be able to discover something – and we can test whether I am in AF or VF.
Going by my own experience I would not rule out the possibility of some sort
of an Altered State of Consciousness experience. You may be interested in this link to an article in which I described several ASCs I had.
If Richard just sits there without thinking anything
– then when I did this, I felt no thoughts, I just heard things – so my senses were operating, but I was not
‘interpreting’ them, it was just sensations, but sensations that were not given meaning – they were things that
could not be given names or words attached to them.
Then when No 81 asked me ‘What were you experiencing’ I switched myself
ON and tried to communicate, however it is at this moment that all ‘interpretations’ come into play. I initially had
no words for it, so I said I was the body, but then I realised I could not be. In the moment of being in STANDBY I was
like everything else in the Universe. There is no label here. I cannot be the body, this comes from the interpretation I
gave it when I switched from STANDBY to ON.
When I have a pure consciousness experience which is a ‘self’-less
experience I have no doubt that I am indeed this body and I have no problems to put labels on the sensate experiencing
of this body.
You can ask Richard to try the same experiment as I
did. I sat there with my eyes closed. A porcelain cup was in front of me. I touched the cup and did nothing to interpret
the cup, I asked no questions. By doing this I could not tell you the shape, form, temperature, size or anything of the
cup, I could not even tell you it was a cup or that there were sensations. So in this state/place, no words could be
applied to what it was that was being experienced as there was no experience. It is when coming from STANDBY to ON, that
you can conclude, that if all you could do was touching or hearing that you are the body. But at this particular moment
I would probably disagree with you and say, actually no, in my experience it is something that I cannot say in words. No
81 tells me that the word for this is ‘Brahma’. I am not interested in the words to explain it, but from what he
describes it seems to be accurate, but it is also a term and one that in this STANDBY state/place makes no sense because
it is an experience that cannot be experienced – I could not say what I was. If Richard could also look into this I
would be grateful, as I am not sure that saying that he is the body is actually it...
I have forwarded your post to Richard as requested but it is pertinent to
point out that actualism is utterly non-spiritual and that Actual Freedom is diametrically opposite to any of the
altered states of consciousness.
If we continue with my experience so far, I see what
makes sense to me is that all religions and so on came into being when someone was in AF and said, ‘What is this state
that cannot experience itself?’ and all the ideas came out of this ... and this is where all the people get into
conflict because it is all concepts, models and hypothesis.
As an actual freedom from the human condition is something entirely new
to human experience – no one has previously discovered that one can change human nature such that one can free oneself
from the instinctual passions as well as from one’s social identity – an Actual Freedom cannot be the foundation of
‘all religions’ for it is the antithesis of all religions.
What is the foundation of all religions is the experience of a permanent
Altered State of Consciousness whereby ‘I’ as ‘Being’ expand into ‘the Greater Self’, also described as
becoming One with the Divine, the Truth, God-Consciousness, the Absolute, etc.
To be honest, if I am in this state of AF (and I
think I am, I am just ‘delayering, disrobing, deprogramming’ old habits that are in play) then I like this state of
STANDBY so much that I am not really interested in doing much else than staying in it – maybe this is what the others
(the people in the ‘ancient’ past) got wrong when they got to this stage, maybe they got too caught up in the ideas
caused by their instincts that they couldn’t stay in this wonderful place ... they thought there must be a better one.
Yes, they got it wrong in that they remained stuck in the glorious affective
experience of ‘Self’-aggrandizement. Richard, who lived in an Altered State of Consciousness for eleven years,
described this bane of humankind in the introduction to his Journal.
If you could pass on the exercise to Richard I would
be grateful, then maybe we can see if we are both in AF and if he could see what he thinks about my experience. I think
that the old religions have got the metaphysics right but what does this all help when you can’t enjoy the place where
you are one part of the whole of the Universe? Also it may be as time goes on that my experience in STANDBY extends to
ON as the delayering continues.
It may be of interest to you that in a ‘self’-less experiencing of the
universe, either in a temporary PCE or a permanent Actual Freedom there is no such thing as meta-physics – in the
actual world there is simply no room for any human-created escapist fantasies. All there is, is the physical universe in
all its splendour.
17.4.2005
Several things have occurred to me since writing you
the first email. The main thing I noticed was that I played down the occurrence of the event that happened at the back
of my brain – if was at the top of the neck, bottom of the brain – it was exactly what Richard described as a
‘turning over’ of something in the brain stem. I have had this experience and much has changed since. Like I
mentioned the ‘deprogramming’ – all this is occurring at a fast rate and my actions are totally factually based as
before.
I know that No 81 is having conversations with the group online to question the language being used by yourself ‘matter
and energy’. He came to me at breakfast to talk about his ideas about this and to explain it to me. To be honest if
the turning over in the back of the brain is the process to AF, then I think I am in AF and am actually now removing all
the ‘old behaviour’ that I had.
It is pertinent to note that Richard described having this experience of
‘something turning over’ when he became enlightened, not when he became actually free –
Richard: About six weeks prior to the sixth of
September 1981 I had a revelation that I was going to really die this time, not become catatonic again, and that I was
to prepare myself for it. I mustered all of my faith and resolution, renewed all of my trust and dedication, and awaited
the day. The night before I could hardly maintain myself as a thinking, functioning human being as a blistering hot and
cold burning sensation crept up the back of my spine and entered into the base of my neck just under the brain itself. I
went to bed in desperation and frustration at my apparent inability to be good enough to carry this ‘process’
through to its supreme conclusion.
The next morning I awoke and all was calm and quiet. Expressing relief at the
cessation of the intensifying ‘process’ that had reached an unbearable level the night before, I lay back on my
pillows to watch the rising sun (my bedroom faced east) through the large bedroom windows. All of a sudden I was gripped
with the realisation that this was the moment! I was going to die! An intense fear raced throughout my body, rising in
crescendo until I could scarcely take any more. As it reached a peak of stark terror, I realised that I had nothing to
worry about and that I was to go with the ‘process’. In an instant all fear left me and I travelled deep into the
depths of my very being. All of a sudden I was sitting bolt upright, laughing, as I realised that this that was IT! was
such a simple thing ... all I had to do was die ... and that was the easiest thing in the world to do. Then the thought
of leaving my family and friends overwhelmed me and I was thrust back on the bed sobbing. Then I was bolt upright once
more laughing my head off ... then I was back on the pillows sobbing my heart out ... upright, laughing ... pillows
sobbing ... upright laughing ... pillows sobbing. At the fifth or sixth time something turned over in the base of my
brain – in the top of the brain-stem. I likened it to turning over a L.P. record in order to play the other side ...
with the vital exception that it would never, ever turn back again. Richard, Articles, A Brief Personal History
Please go to link ../introduction/actualfreedom4.htm where I quote from the AF presentation guide section ‘Actual
Freedom from the Human Condition’:
Richard: ‘The day finally dawns when something irrevocable happens
inside the skull. In an ecstatic moment of being present, ‘I’ as ego and ‘me’ as soul expire … the entire
identity ceases to exist, permanently. There is a sensation inside the top of the brain-stem that is experienced as a
physical ‘turning over’ of some kind ... something that can never, ever, turn back.’
This is what happened to me, and from the above I have assumed that this is
the ‘final’ condition required to be in AF. Is this not the case as nothing more is mentioned in the guide? Perhaps
I should also ask if there is a different type of ‘turning over’ between the ‘enlightened Richard’ and the ‘AF
Richard’ and if so, perhaps you can amend the guide to reflect this?
In Richard’s article ‘A Brief Personal History’ the link to which I
provided to you in my last post, Richard described in detail both his experiences – becoming enlightened and becoming
actually free. Given that he is the only one who has become actually free so far, his is the only description of someone
becoming actually free from both ‘self’ and ‘Self’ that we have to go by. ….
As the ‘physical ‘turning over’ of some kind’ happened to
Richard when he became enlightened there are obviously other criteria to take into consideration if one wants to
genuinely determine if one has become actually free or not. As it is your experience it is obvious that nobody can do
this assessment for you.
This snippet from Richard’s correspondence might also be of interest to you
–
Respondent: A few more questions: 1. Richard, what
is the physiological nature of the ‘process’ that you (and J Krishnamurti, Konrad Swart and numerous others)
underwent during ego dissolution?
Richard: In a word: electrochemical (the spinal cord,
through which all the main nerve fibres go, transmits all kinds of electrochemical signals ... which can result in all
manner of psychic manifestations on occasion).
In the Indian Tradition they are known as ‘Kriyas’.
Respondent: (…) 2. Is ego dissolution a necessary
precursor to ‘soul death’ ...
Richard: No ... if I had known, back in 1981 at the
moment of ego-dissolution, what I now know I would not have let the process stop halfway through its happening.
Respondent: ... or would ego dissolution be an
automatic consequence of dissolving the affective self first?
Richard: Yes ... by my reckoning it would have all been
over in a matter of maybe 6-10 seconds (rather than 6 seconds plus eleven years).
Respondent: 3. Do you think it is possible to
experience the complete dissolution of ego (leaving affective self intact) without lapsing into a delusory ASC?
Richard: No ... the soul-self is extremely powerful
(affectively powerful that is).
Respondent: In other words, is ‘spiritual
enlightenment’ a necessary consequence of ego death (sans soul death) ...
Richard: Yes ... without the ego-self to keep the
soul-self under some semblance of control it runs rampant and totally rules the roost.
Respondent: ... or is ‘enlightenment’ simply a risk
of same?
Richard: No ... some form of an altered state of
consciousness (ASC) would immediately establish itself. [emphasis added]
Richard, List AF, No 60, 29.11.2003
*
So this is what I have been thinking over the course
of the morning: What I found is that when I am on STANDBY, I feel that I am not different from anything in the whole
Universe – not in terms of material, but in terms of something that is not describable. When I go from STANDBY to ON,
there needs to be a question that is asked, such as if I am slouching in STANDBY mode, then my back may ache and I will
automatically correct my posture, but the asking of the question ‘How can I reduce my slouching posture?’ is the
first part of the process of switching myself ON – it is task orientated.
After speaking with No 81 this morning, I would say that the problem of all
religions doesn’t come from this idea of being in this state/ place of STANDBY and relishing this moment of wonder,
but rather it comes when I get switched on by asking ‘What am I?’ If you can ask Richard to test the following out
like I have this morning, then we may be able to discover something – and we can test whether I am in AF or VF.
Going by my own experience I would not rule out the possibility of some sort
of an Altered State of Consciousness experience. You may be interested in this link to an article in which I described several ASCs I had.
I also don’t believe I am in any ASC, ‘I’ have
never more been here!
Considering that you describe your experiences as –
There is no label here. I cannot be the body,
this comes from the interpretation I gave it when I switched from STANDBY to ON. [emphasis
added] No 83, Experiences of the Method, 11.4.2005
– it seems somewhat strange to ask Richard to comment on an experience that
you yourself cannot accurately describe in words, let alone label.
No 81 tells me that the
word for this is ‘Brahma’. I am not interested in the words to explain it, but from what he describes it seems to be
accurate, but it is also a term and one that in this STANDBY state/place makes no sense because it is an experience that
cannot be experienced – I could not say what I was. If Richard could also look into this I would be grateful, as I am
not sure that saying that he is the body is actually it... No 83, Experiences of
the Method, 11.4.2005
Richard is very clear throughout all the descriptions of his experience of an
actual freedom from the human condition that he is the physical body and nothing but the physical body and that he can easily write about (i.e. label) his ongoing
experience. As such it appears that you are, by your own words attempting to liken chalk to cheese.
Footnotes:
1.) … that he is the physical body and nothing but the
physical body –
Respondent No 51: If you are no ‘being’ what are
you?
Richard: What I am is this infinite and eternal and
perpetual universe experiencing itself as an apperceptive human being ... as such the universe is stunningly aware of
its own infinitude. And this is truly wonderful.
Respondent: Pure identification then with the
universe. For eleven years, you were identified with the absolute. Now you say ‘I am ...’, you made a shift to the
universe, only the subject of identification changed.
Richard: Did you not read the question I was responding
to? Perhaps if I were to put it this way then: for eleven years, night and day, it was the ‘being’ within the body
who identified with ‘The Absolute’ ... whereas what I am, as this flesh and blood body only (sans ‘being’
itself), is this universe experiencing itself as an apperceptive human being.
As the universe also experiences itself as a cat, a dog, and so on, and so
on, what you are saying, in effect, is that every body is identifying themselves with the universe ... which is patently
silly (if only because no body needs to identify with what they actually are).
It is this simple: the very stuff of this body (and all bodies) is the very
same-same stuff as the stuff of the universe in that it comes out of the ground in the form of the carrots and lettuce
and milk and cheese, and whatever else is consumed, in conjunction with the air breathed and the water drunk and the
sunlight absorbed.
I am nothing other than that ... that is what I am, literally.
Richard, List AF, No 44, 11.10.2003
*
Respondent: Now by adding the word experience, the
question that arises is who has the experience? The body?
Richard: The body is not ‘who’ has the
experience... the body is *what* has the experience (of being unadulteratedly conscious) as the condition of
being conscious is a bodily condition.
Respondent: The body works with the senses.
Richard: That is one way of putting it but as sentience
means being sensorial it would be more helpful for comprehension of what experiencing means to say that the body works
as the senses: for instance, of all the senses – cutaneous, ocular, aural, olfactory, gustatory, and proprioceptive
– the cutaneal sense, being by far the largest of all senses (the skin covers the entire body) is what
defines/delineates where the body stops and the rest of the world begins/where the rest of the world stops and the body
begins ... the skin is the main demarcation line, so to speak, thus cutaneous experiencing is major experiencing by any
definition.
Respondent: If we must attach to the body even the
consciousness, then we can go very far.
Richard: That just does not make sense: consciousness
– the condition of a body being conscious – is indistinguishable from what a body is (when it is alive, awake, and
sensible) ... to say that consciousness is something attached to the body is to imply that consciousness (the condition
of being conscious) is a clip-on, a removable accessory, as it were.
Respondent: We may have any illusion and blame the
body for that.
Richard: Yea verily ... anything but put the ‘blame’
onto where it really lies (on the ‘being’ within the body), eh?
Richard, List AF, No 44, 12.10.2003 
2.) … that he can easily write about (i.e.
label) his ongoing experience –
Respondent: You talk about your day but say there is
no feeling of being. How then can you write about your experience?
Richard: As is evidenced in a pure consciousness
experience (PCE), the flesh and blood body is entirely capable of thinking, reflecting, appraising and implementing
considered action for benevolent reasons of its own accord. In fact it is remarkably simple: it is surprisingly easy to
live and function without any ‘I’ and/or ‘Me’ or any ‘self’ and/or ‘Self’ whatsoever ... it is such a
vast improvement upon ‘me’ doing all the daily tasks that it is a delight to just contemplate the difference.
‘I’ unnecessarily complicate this otherwise simple living with ‘my’ needs, ‘my’ demands, ‘my’ wants,
‘my’ shoulds, ‘my’ musts, ‘my’ beliefs, ‘my’ morals, ‘my’ values, ‘my’ principles, ‘my’
ideals, and so on. Not to mention ‘my’ sadness and ‘my’ empathy, ‘my’ likes and ‘my’ dislikes, ‘my’
loves and ‘my’ hates, ‘my’ fears and ‘my’ trusts, ‘my’ revenges and ‘my’ pardons, ‘my’
jealousies and ‘my’ faithfulness, ‘my’ blamings and ‘my’ forgiveness, ‘my’ loneliness and ‘my’
belonging ... the list goes on and on.
This body is eminently competent in functioning autonomously: the stomach
tells the brain (wherein lies the will which, with its data-correlating ability, is nothing more grand than the
nerve-organising organ of the body) when it is empty. The stomach secretes a chemical when unoccupied which triggers a
receptor in the brain that gives rise to a sensation humans ignorantly call ‘I am hungry’. Indeed, tests have been
done by people who delight in doing these things, wherein the chemical was injected into volunteers who had just eaten a
full meal: the chemical caused them to feel hungry despite their distended stomachs. Thus ‘I’, thinking and feeling
that ‘I’ am an important part of the process, step in and incorrectly say: ‘‘I’ am hungry’. ‘I’ am not
hungry at all (how can a psychological or psychic entity need corporeal food) ... it is that the stomach is simply
signalling its emptiness to the brain via the autonomic nervous system.
Likewise the bladder tells the brain when it is full, and so on. When ‘I’
says ‘I want to got to the toilet’, ‘I’ am not busting for a pee at all ... the bladder is merely indicating its
fullness. Once again, a psychological and psychic entity cannot manufacture physical urine ... it is absurd.
Furthermore, the empty stomach instructs the legs, via the will function of the physical brain, to walk to the cupboard
for food. The eyes, seeing an empty cupboard and thus triggering remembered experience, will advise the legs, via the
brain’s organising capability, to walk the body to a shop. An empty wallet will tell the legs to take the body to a
bank ... and an empty bank account will demonstrate that it is time to get a job (or go on a pension or whatever). I am
neither being pedantic nor facetious here ... it is actually this simple. Without an ‘I’ and/or ‘me’, one is
this very sensuous flesh and blood body being apperceptively aware, living in the actual world of people, things and
events ... not an ‘I’ and/or ‘me’ living in the grim and glum real world, forever cut off from the magnificence
of this luscious actual world by ‘my’ unreal existence, thinking and feeling that ‘I’ have to make responsible
and onerous decisions.
‘I’ and/or ‘me’ can never be here in this magical fairy-tale-like
actual world for ‘I’ and/or ‘me’ am an interloper, an alien in psychological and psychic possession of the body:
‘I’ and/or ‘me’ do not belong here. All this is impossible to conceive, believe, imagine or in any other way
visualise ... which is why it is essential to be confident that the actual world does exist. In order to mutate from a
self-centred licentiousness to a self-less sensualism, one must have confidence in the ultimate beneficence of the
universe. This confidence is born out of knowing that the grim and glum ‘real world’ is pasted as a veneer over the
top of actual world that underlies everyday reality. This knowing is a solid and irrefutable knowing which is derived
from the PCE and is an essential ingredient to ensure success. In such a peak experience everything is seen, with
unparalleled clarity and purity, to be already perfect – that humans are all living in perfection – if only one
would act upon one’s seeing. Because in a PCE, wherein apperception is operating unimpeded, it is irrefutably
experienced that thought, thoughts and thinking happen of their own accord as is necessary ... for it is the function of
the brain to do so.
Consequently, this flesh and blood body being apperceptively aware easily and
delightedly writes about its on-going experiencing. Richard, List C, No 4, 1.5.2000
 Actualism Homepage
Freedom from the
Human Condition – Happy and Harmless
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